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  • terris

    How does this differ from structures?

    • Michael Davey

      I'm not sure. I haven't seen structures in use (that I am aware of). Are there any examples on tw.o or doc.tw.o?

      From reading the docs, it soulds like structures are using phplayers, where as page groups are multiple wiki namespaces that can be referenced from each other using NameSpaceName.PageName and translates to NameSpaceName/PageName as a URL.

      Take a look at the PmWiki, TwikiWiki and nslu2-linux links above.

    • Gustavo Muslera

      Is the difference between flat namespace and hierarchical one. Think if you want to have 2 er... "formal" online books in a tiki site, i.e. in the doc site, one the user manual and the other the admin manual. Both can be in structures, but what if both need or want to have a page called "Introduction" or "Preface"?

      Now, with this, suppose you have a group called UserManual and another AdminManual. In each book, you can refer to the page "Preface" and it will be externally named "UserManual.Preface", but when editing pages in the UserManual group you only have to link to the Preface page.

      Of course, for more complex sites the possibility of collisions are bigger, specially in multiuser/heterogenous systems where all write what they want how they want. Having this kind of "groups" could open the door for new kind of concepts and permissions, i.e. one to differenciate users that can extend namespaces/group names or not, or something that enables admin that users only can write to UserPagemyuser and UserPagemyuser.*

  • Gustavo Muslera

    • Be ".", "/" or ":", if already is not used migration to this feature is transparent as all are in the "main" namespace, just is needed adding the logic to parse qualified page names and append current namespace to linked pages if they are not fully qualified
    • A namespace is a name or a wiki page name? Are used as something new, but have existence of their own? I.e. if i create the wiki page TikiPageGroups, this is a namespace already? I can create i.e. TikiPageGroups.History? or can I just create Book.Index, Book.Preface, Book.Chapter1 and never a wiki page/"namespace" but the Book namespace by itself exist/can be referenced somewhat? Or I have to first go to an instance of creating a page group named whatever and then can create pages named whatever.pagename?
    • As I said in the previous comment, it could open some doors in the permission front. If I can edit a page in a namespace, maybe have sense to enable me to edit new pages in the same namespace, but not in others, think in normal users having its own content, inside their own namespace. This always will have some implications of giving special permissions to user groups over a page group.
    • This will shorten a bit more the charset that can be used for page names
    • Making it optional, the logic of linking internally inside names must check if the admin want namespaces/pagegroups

    - / 5

  • colorado

    For those working on this, please consider the implementation in a multi-Tiki webspace. Many of us are moving in that direction anyway. Could the Structures feature, somehow connected across multi tiki installations provide this?

    • Michael Davey

      Have a look at the last paragraph of Wiki: AnchorsQuestion for one possible approach to connecting across external tiki installations. Perhaps if namespaced wiki pages could also be prefixed with external wiki names, something like:

      ((TikiWiki:NameSpace.Page))

      ?

      • Damian Parker

        To use multi-tiki as namespaces you already have the syntax NameSpace:Page

        Damian

        • Michael Davey

          Yup - simply need to ensure it continues to work if internal wiki namespaces are added.
          The one before the ":" (in both examples) can be thought of as the external Wiki namespace.

        • colorado

          In the Admin menu, use the External Wikis option to set up this capability.

  • Phil MacGovern

    This idea has some pluses and minuses.

    I would really appreciate the recognition of having the link occur within the namespace automatically. The problem is, I could see where that would be really annoying; For example, in a forum post you can refer to a page using WikiWords and the link will be automatically determined; what if there are two pages in different namespaces with the same name? Forums wouldn't be part of a namespace. It seems that once you implement namespaces on Wiki pages that you are sort of limiting the usefulness of the 'linking' that Wiki gives you. It is great to write pages (I have a lot of documentation on our internal knowledge base site) that can be easily referenced from the outside (of the pure Wiki environment - forums, articles, and FAQs). For example, our data dictionary is online as a structure. A developer simply needs to type a table name in a post to link to the entry about that table. If I happened to make a page with the same name in a different namespace, then the system would be unable to link to the correct one.

    On the other hand, the namespace idea could greatly enhance some of the security aspects of the pages. Since an individual page can belong to more than one structure, it is impossible to use them for security. Pages would exist in only one namespace; access to that namespace could be controlled.

    •

      Michael Davey

      Well, the namespaces feature would be optional so admins can decide on a site-by-site basis whether they want this feature switched on or not.

      With namespaces turned on, linking from a forum would be just the same as linking from a wiki page - you could provide the fully qualified name to ensure you get the right document: an unqualified name would link to the document in the default namespace.

  • terris

    I've attempted to use categories to group pages together. At first I used generic names like "Bugs" and "Product Specifications". Then, I moved on to Release 2 and needed the same categories except for Release 2. So I'd have to create the same categories with slightly different names.

    Using categories is a BAD WAY to organize wikis that have namespaces!

    • Phil MacGovern

      I personally used categories as a security method. If the page was categorized, a user had to belong to a group with the same name as the category to have access.